On-line: Миша Т, mikado 5448, гостей 1. Всего: 3 [подробнее..]
Правила: Форум предназначен для обсуждения военно-исторической и военно-технической тематик. Оскорбления, мат, расистские и оскорбляющие достоинство человека высказывания не допускаются.

АвторСообщение
Бронемашинист




Сообщение: 138
Зарегистрирован: 01.12.07
Откуда: Россия, Пятигорск
Репутация: 3
ссылка на сообщение  Отправлено: 21.02.08 13:26. Заголовок: Хорватские бронепоезда 2МВ (Croatian armored train 2WW)


Случайно наткнулся на ссылку и был удивлён. Судя по всему живой образец бронеплощадки и даже не реплика
http://ccgi.ajg41.plus.com/2007/10/01/armoured-train-in-sarajevo/
интересно было бы получить полее подробную информация и детальный валкэраунд

Спасибо: 0 
ПрофильЦитата Ответить
Ответов - 6 [только новые]


генералуудад хошууч генерал


Сообщение: 424
Зарегистрирован: 01.12.07
Откуда: Урянхайский край, Белоцарск
Репутация: 3
ссылка на сообщение  Отправлено: 21.02.08 15:39. Заголовок: С чего взял что хорв..


С чего взял что хорватский, а не итальянско-германский?

БНМАУ-ын Цэргийн явдлын яам Спасибо: 0 
ПрофильЦитата Ответить
Бронемашинист




Сообщение: 139
Зарегистрирован: 01.12.07
Откуда: Россия, Пятигорск
Репутация: 3
ссылка на сообщение  Отправлено: 21.02.08 23:45. Заголовок: Белик Сай Хан пишет:..


Белик Сай Хан пишет:

 цитата:
С чего взял что хорватский, а не итальянско-германский?

да так, птичка на хвосте принесла.

Introduction to Armored Trains and Armored Train Companies
by H.L. deZeng IV

The first measure to develop improvised (or provisional) armored trains stems from August or early September 1941. An improvised Croatian armored train is known to have been attached to the Croatian Bosanska Division and was operating along the tracks in the Maglaj - Doboj area in East Bosnia on 11 September 1941. It was still being used there during the second half of November 1941 in support of Croatian operations to encircle Partisan bands in the Ozren Mountains that lie between the Bosna River and Tuzla. On 28 January 1942 two Croatian armored trains are known to have been operating in the Doboj - Maglaj - Trbuk area under the control of 4th Infantry Division. During this early period, until approximately late spring 1942, the crew for the armored train(s) usually numbered about 30 men and were provided by the 800-man Croatian Railway Battalion (see under Technical Troops) located in Slavonski Brod. (1)

In April 1942 the Croatian Defense Ministry (MINDOM) ordered the railway car factory in Slavonski Brod to immediately establish a department for the construction and repair of armored railway cars. This was the first attempt to move from the improvisation of armored trains to the actual manufacturing of them, and in July 1942 the government placed an order with the factor for 20 armored railway cars.

Concurrently, MINDOM began forming armored train companies as special units within several of the infantry regiments. By 1943, the typical Croatian armored train had 4 to 7 armored railway cars crewed by a half-company of infantry, and was armed with two stationary Renault FT 17/18 tanks (each with a 3.7 cm gun), one medium mortar, two heavy machine guns and four light machine guns. The tanks were stationary in the sense that they could not be dismounted from the flatcars that carried them.

At first, the Croatians had total control over their armored trains, but when the Germans set up a special command - Railway Security Staff Croatia - in November/December 1942, this control was lost at the higher and tactical levels, although the Croatians continued to exercise administrative authority over their units.

By 1 September 1943 there were at least two armored train companies with a total strength of 364 officers and men operating 7 or 8 armored trains and provisional (improvised) armored trains. The number of companies and trains increased through 1944.


Footnotes
1. Coli?, Mladen - Takozvana Nezavisna Dr?ava Hrvatska 1941 (Belgrade: Delta-pres, 1973); NARA WashDC: RG 242 (T-314 LXIX. AK order of battle charts); (T-315 roll 1554/470; roll 2265 and roll 2267).

Armored Train Companies

1. Armored Train Company (1. satnija oklopljenih vlakova)
Formed in 1942 and is believed to have belonged to the 1st Infantry Regiment. In November 1942 its HQ was in Doboj/East Bosnia. By 1 September 1944 in had moved to Slavonski Brod. No further information has been found.

2. Armored Train Company (2. satnija oklopljenih vlakova)
Formed in 1942 as a component of the 2d Infantry Regiment. On 1 September 1943 it was operating Armored Trains No. 1 and No. 2 along the tracks to the north and east of Zagreb under Croatian I Corps, but under the tactical control of German Railway Security Staff Croatia. Still in existence in March 1944. No further information has been found.

3. Armored Train Company (3. satnija oklopljenih vlakova)
Formed in 1942 to crew armored trains assigned to the Croatian III Corps area. In August 1944 it was operating Armored Trains Ris, Vuk and Lisac in Bosnia and Hercegovina under III Corps. No further information has been found.

4. Armored Train Company (4. satnija oklopljenih vlakova)
No information has been found on this company other than the fact that it existed.

5. Armored Train Company (5. satnija oklopljenih vlakova)
Formed late 1943 in Karlovac as a component of the 3d Infantry Regiment. On 7 March 1944 it was operating two armored trains in the Karlovac area under I Operations Sector/Croatian I Corps. Company strength on that date was 5 officers, 18 NCOs and 141 men. In September 1944 it was operating armored trains along the rail section Karlovac - Zagreb - Ozalj - Re?ica - Glogorni?ki Mosr under 2d Garrison Brigade/Croatian I Corps. No further information has been found.


Croatian Armored Trains

Note: some of these trains carry a number and some carry a name. Some of them may be one and the same train. Not enough information is available to sort them out, assuming that this would be possible. It is the nature of armored trains, and all trains for that matter, that the locomotives and railway cars can be uncoupled, switched around, renamed and reassigned.

Armored Train No. 1 (Oklopni vlak br. 1)
1943-44 operating along the railway lines to the north and east of Zagreb. Crewed by the 2d Armored Train Co.

Armored Train No. 1 (Oklopni vlak br. 1)
Aug - Sep 43: operating along the track section Maglaj - Zavidovi?i and Sarajevo - Visoko in East Bosnia. Crewed by 3d Armored Train Co.

Armored Train No. 2 (Oklopni vlak br. 2)
Apr 42: first identified. Operated along the railway lines to the north and east of Zagreb. Crewed by the 2d Armored Train Co.

Armored Train No. 2 Vuk (Oklopni vlak br. 2 Vuk)
Aug - Sep 43: operated along the track sections Sarajevo - Vi?egrad and Sarajevo - Vardi?te. Crewed by 3d Armored Train Co. On 4 September 1944 it was noted as operating from the Ustipra?a railway station under the control of III Replacement Brigade/III Corps (HQ in Sarajevo).


Armored Train No. 3 (Oklopni vlak br. 3)
1943-45: operated from the Karlovac railway station along the track sections Karlovac - Zagreb and Ozalj - Re?ica. Crewed by the 5th Armored Train Co.

Armored Train No. 3 Lisac (Oklopni vlak br. 3 Lisac)
Aug - Sep 43: operated along the track sections Visoko - Lasva and Sarajevo - Rama. Crewed by 3d Armored Train Co. In August 1944 it was operating from the Stambul?i? railway station under the control of XI Ustasha Brigade/III Corps.

Armored Train Ris (Oklopni vlak Ris)
1 Mar 44: operated from the Konjic railway station along the track section Rama - Bradina. In August 1944 it was operating along the track section Sarajevo - Mostar.

Provisional Armored Train Gabela (Pomo?ni ?eljezni?ki oklopni vlak Gabela)
4 Sep 44: operated from the Gabela railway station in the Metkovi? of South Dalmatia under the control of IX Ustasha Brigade/III Corps.

Provisional Armored Train La?va (Pomo?ni ?eljezni?ki oklopni vlak La?va)
4 Sep 44: operated from the La?va railway station in the Zenica area of East Bosnia under the control of the XVII Railway Security Battalion/III Corps.

Provisional Armored Train Neretva (Pomo?ni ?eljezni?ki oklopni vlak Neretva)
1 Mar 44: operating from the Jablanica railway station along the track section Rama - Mostar under the control of the 2d Mountain Brigade/III Corps. On 4 September 1944 it was operating from the Ostro?ac railway station.

Provisional Armored Train Vare? (Pomo?ni ?eljezni?ki oklopni vlak Vare?)
1 Sep 43: operated from the Vare? railway station in East Bosnia along the track section Vare? - Podlugovi.

Provisional Armored Train Zenica I (Pomo?ni ?eljezni?ki oklopni vlak Zenica I)
1 Sep 43: operated from the Kankanj railway station along the track section La?va - Visoko.

Provisional Armored Train Zenica II (Pomo?ni ?eljezni?ki oklopni vlak Zenica II)
4 Sep 44: operated from the Zenica railway station under the control of the XVII Railway Security Battalion/III Corps.

From: http://www.axishistory.com/index.php?id=6950


Спасибо: 0 
ПрофильЦитата Ответить
генералуудад хошууч генерал


Сообщение: 428
Зарегистрирован: 01.12.07
Откуда: Урянхайский край, Белоцарск
Репутация: 3
ссылка на сообщение  Отправлено: 22.02.08 07:24. Заголовок: Принято. Жалко АХФ у..


Принято. Жалко АХФ умер.

БНМАУ-ын Цэргийн явдлын яам Спасибо: 0 
ПрофильЦитата Ответить
Бронемашинист




Сообщение: 140
Зарегистрирован: 01.12.07
Откуда: Россия, Пятигорск
Репутация: 3
ссылка на сообщение  Отправлено: 22.02.08 13:45. Заголовок: Фотогалерея


Здесь вперемешку и бронепоезда нормальной колеи и узкоколейка, просто не разгребал
Имеющий глаза да увидит


Спасибо: 0 
ПрофильЦитата Ответить
Бронемашинист




Сообщение: 194
Зарегистрирован: 01.12.07
Откуда: Россия, Пятигорск
Репутация: 3
ссылка на сообщение  Отправлено: 19.04.08 10:02. Заголовок: http://ipicture.ru/u..




Спасибо: 0 
ПрофильЦитата Ответить





Сообщение: 50
Настроение: как обычно
Зарегистрирован: 21.06.08
Откуда: Россия, Уфа
Репутация: 0
ссылка на сообщение  Отправлено: 14.08.08 18:04. Заголовок: А есть ли ещё информ..


А есть ли ещё информация и литература по хорв. бепо?

Спасибо: 0 
ПрофильЦитата Ответить
Ответ:
1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9
большой шрифт малый шрифт надстрочный подстрочный заголовок большой заголовок видео с youtube.com картинка из интернета картинка с компьютера ссылка файл с компьютера русская клавиатура транслитератор  цитата  кавычки моноширинный шрифт моноширинный шрифт горизонтальная линия отступ точка LI бегущая строка оффтопик свернутый текст

показывать это сообщение только модераторам
не делать ссылки активными
Имя, пароль:      зарегистрироваться    
Тему читают:
- участник сейчас на форуме
- участник вне форума
Все даты в формате GMT  3 час. Хитов сегодня: 291
Права: смайлы да, картинки да, шрифты да, голосования нет
аватары да, автозамена ссылок вкл, премодерация откл, правка нет